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AmazonHeart
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 772
Location: Pacific Northwest
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 Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:20 pm Post subject: Just wrong |
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From a post elsewhere on the internet about CT 2008:
| Quote: | Michfest is no longer it's main thing, though certainly its still important to CT. The "WBW"(such a BS phrase) policy is pretty much unenforced and it seems like the majority of festies either don't care if trans* women are there or want trans* women there. In fact, some festies who left early left their wristbands with CT for trans* women to get in and another festy donated money for tickets for trans* women. I missed the days we walked the line, but I heard that reception was mixed which is pretty normal. Though there were some folks that didn't talk to any negative people at all.
The mtf-spectrum folks who went to fest all had a good time, they even hosted a workshop on ENDA. One woman I talked to said that one festie she had spoken with in the line recognized her and came over and said hi and was very glad that she had made it into fest. |
Bolds mine. You know, this is just so wrong on every conceivable level. Feh-muh-nust spends hours and hours, weeks and weeks raising money for tickets for women who can't afford to go to Fest so they can go. Some of my friends paid the upper limit of the sliding scale this year because they knew it might be tough given the economy, and they don't have a lot of money, either, they scratched and scraped themselves but they wanted to support the Festival.
And then we have FESTIES giving their wristbands to CT people so they can not only stroll through the gates but stroll through without paying a penny. This is basically theft.
E-mail me at heartsees2@aol.com if you want to read the rest of this and I'll send you the link. I refuse to participate in driving any traffic to this person.
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dirtywhiteboi
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Joined: 05 Feb 2007
Posts: 784
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:53 pm Post subject: Re: Just wrong |
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| AmazonHeart wrote: | From a post elsewhere on the internet about CT 2008:
| Quote: | Michfest is no longer it's main thing, though certainly its still important to CT. The "WBW"(such a BS phrase) policy is pretty much unenforced and it seems like the majority of festies either don't care if trans* women are there or want trans* women there. In fact, some festies who left early left their wristbands with CT for trans* women to get in and another festy donated money for tickets for trans* women. I missed the days we walked the line, but I heard that reception was mixed which is pretty normal. Though there were some folks that didn't talk to any negative people at all.
The mtf-spectrum folks who went to fest all had a good time, they even hosted a workshop on ENDA. One woman I talked to said that one festie she had spoken with in the line recognized her and came over and said hi and was very glad that she had made it into fest. |
Bolds mine. You know, this is just so wrong on every conceivable level. Feh-muh-nust spends hours and hours, weeks and weeks raising money for tickets for women who can't afford to go to Fest so they can go. Some of my friends paid the upper limit of the sliding scale this year because they knew it might be tough given the economy, and they don't have a lot of money, either, they scratched and scraped themselves but they wanted to support the Festival.
And then we have FESTIES giving their wristbands to CT people so they can not only stroll through the gates but stroll through without paying a penny. This is basically theft.
E-mail me at heartsees2@aol.com if you want to read the rest of this and I'll send you the link. I refuse to participate in driving any traffic to this person. |
I saw that, especially since the person saying the above mentioned me by name. Personally I dont believe it, I think its just another fruitcake trying to save face because Mich Fest wont let the MENZ come in and play.
dirt
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case333
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Joined: 08 Jun 2008
Posts: 105
Location: ny
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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Every time I log on here, I get more convinced that the only ethical thing to do is to push back against this pathology.
It's important not to buy into the myth that lesbians are a dying breed. We're not.
We're just not living out our lives and fantasies on the internet like the gender and body dysmorphic types.
AmazonHeart, Dirt I stand with you.
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AmazonHeart
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 772
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:38 pm Post subject: Of course |
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Of course, the "Festies" who "left early" and ripped off the festival by giving their bracelet(s) to CT people might have been CT people in the first place and not Festies at all, like the CT person who facilitated a workshop on ENDA on the land.
No matter what, we all know each woman pays for her own ticket and to give their bracelet to someone who hasn't paid is stealing from Fest.
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AmazonHeart
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Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 772
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:42 pm Post subject: Juhlgold |
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I keep thinking of poor juhlgold up there in the Michfest 2008 folder who was pleading for help to get to Fest for days and days, she really needed to get home. The last I heard she was going to go $137 or so short and hoped to sell her art outside the gates in hopes of being able to buy a ticket.
Then we have these jokers at CT sharing bracelets around. Who knows how that might work. Maybe one or two CT people buy two bracelets and then share those two around all week long amongst everybody at CT with different people going to Fest whenever, having invested, themselves, absolutely nothing in the Festival experience.
Then we wonder why there are so many people on the land who seem to not understand what the Festival is about. One thing everybody should know it is not about is ripping women off.
Last edited by AmazonHeart on Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:59 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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AmazonHeart
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Posts: 772
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:51 pm Post subject: Ugh |
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Ugh, I can't get over this. Most of us wear our bracelets until they literally fall off of our wrists, like, eight or nine months after Fest, and then we save them forever with all of our Michfest stuff. The thought of giving our bracelet away or sharing it around wouldn't even occur to us. God.
Sorry for the serial posting, I just cannot believe this. Even if it's a lie -- and I don't think it is, I'm not going to give that benefit of the doubt -- it's a really disgusting lie designed to show contempt for the wimmin of the Festival. So if there's all of this contempt then why the dedication to going there at all?
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Rabbit.Leaps
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Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 1316
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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wristbands do not eaily slide off and on. and frankly... i suspect the original author to be making it up or at least exagerating.
really.... "it seems like the majority of festies either don't care if trans* women are there or want trans* women there. " ???
sounds like someone's wishful thinking to me.
pfft
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hypatia's child
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Posts: 200
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Rabbit.Leaps wrote: | | wristbands do not eaily slide off and on. and frankly... i suspect the original author to be making it up or at least exagerating. |
My thought as well... I think they probably did it more as a symbolic gesture than anything else. I totally support a festie fund for all women including those who have transitioned (MtF), but to attend and then give your own wristband to someone else... even if it were possible, I agree that would be cheating and disrespectful of Festival.
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Womyn2me
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Posts: 738
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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I am super tired of being told that there is no place in the world for WBW specific events, that transwomen are just like all other women when the behavior of the trans activists is directly contrary to the way women in community operate.
EDITED to remove something until I have it confirmed. but if it turns out to be true, hell hath no fury...
Last edited by Womyn2me on Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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AmazonHeart
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Posts: 772
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 4:44 pm Post subject: True |
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Yeah, this person does make stuff up, it's true. As for wishful thinking, considering the source, I think it's more like propaganda, i.e., something like, there are only a few fossils with one foot in the grave who still care about womon-only space. Which really is propaganda.
So true Womyn2Me, the way this shows zero understanding of how wimmin in community operate. The disconnect stuns.
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Rabbit.Leaps
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Posts: 1316
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Womyn2me wrote: | I have gone from a person who has worked in the GLBT community for years with an understanding of why everyone is involved to deciding this fest to actively work AGAINST trans inclusion in the lesbian community.
I am super tired of being told that there is no place in the world for WBW specific events, that transwomen are just like all other women when the behavior of the trans activists is directly contrary to the way women in community operate. |
Womyn2me.... I completely understand your statement and could have used those very words to describe my own experience.
It seems that having anything specifically for WBW or even specifically for lesbians only is not acceptable.
I will not say that ALL MtF transpeople have those behaviors we think of as being so contrary to the concept of womyn's community. I personally know (as in real time, face to face) 2 MtF transwomen who are quite respectful of the concept of WBW space but there certainly seem to be a good number who do not operate that way. I suspect there are many more who feel *they* ought to be the exception to the rule so long as they fly under the radar.
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Nedra
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Posts: 738
Location: New York
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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I wonder why it is that a boundary that is stated, but not actively enforced is being translated as an invitation...
Who does that? What are our choices? If we don't restate the boundaries again and again and refuse to sell tickets (which opens the festival to lawsuit), then we "don't care if trans* women are there or want trans* women there."
Its so disturbing to me. Honestly. Cause don't we all *know* that scenerio?
If we fight, we might hurt ourselves. If we don't fight, we wanted it.
Wanting WBW only space is not about hating transwomen. It's about WBW.
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Rabbit.Leaps
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Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Nedra wrote: | | If we fight, we might hurt ourselves. If we don't fight, we wanted it. |
heh.... read that again. sounds like the delema of a womon being raped.
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Nedra
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Posts: 738
Location: New York
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Rape is the extreme magnification of that same mode of thinking. It's not rape. But it's still a violation. And it still triggers shit we shouldn't have to experience on the Land. The lack of understanding of that only futher repels me from the transwomen who do attend -- *actively*, *knowingly* against the intended boundaries.
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StellaMaris
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Posts: 91
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Rabbit.Leaps wrote: |
I will not say that ALL MtF transpeople have those behaviors we think of as being so contrary to the concept of womyn's community. I personally know (as in real time, face to face) 2 MtF transwomen who are quite respectful of the concept of WBW space but there certainly seem to be a good number who do not operate that way. I suspect there are many more who feel *they* ought to be the exception to the rule so long as they fly under the radar. |
"Some of my best friends are black."
"You're one of the good ones."
I personally know many cis women who are supportive of and respectful to the idea of women-only space including trans women, including MichFest. Unlike you, though, I'm not saying that to imply that they "know their place." I'm just saying that not all women are judgmental and prejudiced.
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